Microsoft Response Point PBX voice-recognition "magic button"
Submitted by ethans on Tue, 01/29/2008 - 4:47pm.
Like many of you, I’ve been following Microsoft’s entry into the PBX market. While their product is obviously not mature or even really available on the market yet, their “magic button” concept really grabbed my attention. Push the button and you can call someone, park a call and transfer a call….all with your voice.
So I got to thinking. Asterisk has really high quality speech recognition capabilities through the commercial LumenVox software. I had already created a voice recognition company directory based on LumenVox, but could I utilize Asterisk and LumenVox to replicate (or even enhance) the functionality of Microsoft’s Response Point?
Well, the answer is yes, and it is awesome. Take a look at this blog post for details:
http://www.freepbx.org/news/2008-01-29/microsoft-response-point-pbx-aste...
Also, watch FreePBX on Friday for the source code release of my Asterisk Voice Recognition Company Directory, a tree-based drag-and-drop company directory with voice recognition capabilities.
You are a serious tease.
Tue, 01/29/2008 - 8:41pm
If you havent read the link
Wed, 01/30/2008 - 10:04am
If you havent read the link yet dont let the word Microsoft scare you check it out....
Thought I would point out
Thu, 01/31/2008 - 9:48am
Thought I would point out that it seems this Magic Button is gaining steam in the community.
http://blog.tmcnet.com/blog/tom-keating/asterisk/asteriskbased-fr...
Released?
Tue, 02/05/2008 - 8:06pm
So let me be the voice of
Tue, 02/05/2008 - 9:19pm
So let me be the voice of reason here since there hasn't been any so far. Trixbox and FreePBX are free software packages that developers have pointed out many times that nobody ever donates to because the point being that they are FREE. So now you take this "magic button" that requires a Lumenvox license which if you try, you can get one channel for $50 and then its $250 per additional channel. Let's say you have a 10 person company, you probably need to be prepared for a 1:4 ratio so you probably need 3-4 licenses to make sure it works all the time, so you are looking at $800 for this functionality in a very small business which could easily be $3,000 for a larger install. If these same companies aren't willing to fork $50 to donate to the software development they sure as hell won't pay hundreds or thousands of dollars for this feature. Is it a cool feature? Perhaps, is it worth the hype its been getting when nobody is going to shell out a freaking dime to get it? No.
Don't get me wrong, I applaud the work it took to create it but for the obviously overwhelming majority of trixbox/freepbx users it is worthless because of the cost of the Lumenvox license.
--- Fred - The Voice of Reason ---
dstroot, you call me out for
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 9:37am
dstroot, you call me out for making sense?
The trixbox/FreePBX user communities have PROVEN time and time again that they do NOT have a willingness to pay for ANYTHING. Ask the folks at Lumenvox how many licenses they have sold and they answer is "not very many". Ask Kerry and Phillipe how much they get in donations and the answer is "basically nothing". But you are saying I am full of it because I dare to say that this is a waste because the user communities as we know them today are not willing to pay for the software licenses to make it work? What Utopian planet do you come from? Most certainly not Terra Firma. Get a clue and realize that it is not I that have my bowels full of fecal matter, it is you that has his own skull cap firmly inserted into his own colon.
As I said, the coding is very cool and I respect the guys who did it, but it is a shame that virtually nobody will use it because of the cost.
Fred - The Voice of
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 4:56pm
Fred - The Voice of Reason:
Disclaimer: I have not seen the code and I have no idea how it works.
Counter Argument: Your sole issue is that folks will not buy the Lumenvox licenses right? My reasoning is that once we see the code there will several options one could pursue - including replacing the Lumenvox voices with an open source alternative. Therefore people who choose to do so could get a "free" magic button, except maybe compromise on quality, while others could pay for the higher quality voices if they choose. There are also folks who get around some licensing issues by outputting WAV files and playing those, but I am not advocating that.
Final Counter Argument: Those companies you refer to that won't pay $800-$3000 for the function - do they have computers, phones, personnel, office lease, etc.? I bet those were not "free" right? They obviously must buy some things if needs/wants dictate.
Highly Functional Features
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 10:15am
Highly functional features like the "magic button" and handset applications utilizing XML are great for VAR's and resellers who are looking to get an edge. While the opportunity for extra revenue is there, these highly functional features are especially useful in the sales pitch. One thing I have learned from hundreds of sales calls is once you have defused the reservations a potential customer has about you and show them highly functional demonstrations that blow the competition out of the water, price is no longer an objection and the competition essentially evaporates in the customer's mind. Now you can charge the $1500 to $2000 an extension that Cisco and Nortel get because your solution is not only as good, it is better.
The argument about "LumenVox is too expensive" is just an attempt to create FUD.
To hear more about selling techniques please visit my blog at http://schmoozecom.blogspot.com. I will also be discussing things like this at lengths when I speak at the Open Telephony Training Seminar. Fore more details on the training seminar please visit http://freepbx.org/open-telephony-training-seminar
dstroot, you might want to
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 11:06am
dstroot, you might want to stop showing your ignorance. The magic button uses Lumenvox which requires a license fee and the alternative is Sphinx which does not work well enough.
Tony, I am not throwing FUD, I am saying that the TYPICAL users will not pay for it. Your model is not typical, because you are "doing it right" from what I can see and what I have heard. The other guys are taking trixbox, slapping it on a box, and walking away. The true value to customers is being a VAR which you obviously are, at that point you are providing a complete solutions package versus "installing a new phone system". More trixbox integrators would be more successful if they followed the value added reseller model, however, that takes more than the smarts to install trixbox, it requires strong business sense and the ability to analyze a companies business needs. That is not something the typical trixbox installer does today.
Sounds like the 'typical
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 1:20pm
Sounds like the 'typical trixbox installer' could benefit from the sales training that we are providing, if there is any validity to your comments which I'm sure no one has the data to prove or disprove. But we already know your opinion of that training that you expressed so colorfully in another thread. And I must say, other people had the civility to NOT tell you to "stop showing your ignorance" in the comments you made that were a reflection of your own lack of knowledge or information. You would do well to listen to your own advice and stop digging your own hole deeper and deeper.
Do you not read these
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 1:50pm
Do you not read these forums? Do you not read your own posts? Do you not listen to people? It appears that the only thing you can do lately is to come here to promote your training since you obviously aren't getting enough people signed up from your own site which you claim is a larger user base than the trixbox community. The trixbox team should rightfully remove all posts promoting your training since they do not allow any other company to promote their products and services in the forums as it is considered forum spam. While there may be a few fanboys of yours here the reality is you are as hypocritical as they come. Come on, even the name "Free"PBX and yet you are trying everything in your power to make it PayPBX with support, hardware systems, and now training (all things Fonality did first...makes you go hmmmmm). I am quite comfortable with my upfront and honest opinions and statements while you are often hypocritical, constantly beat around the bush, try to slide snide comments in, and while bashing companies like Fonality for being successful when you obviously are jealous of their successes and want to be in their shoes. So you would do well to listen to yourself and stop being a pompus ass.
-- The voice of reason prevails --
fbosco...
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 2:06pm
Why don't you reveal your real identity? I really don't see anyone else here behaving the way you are...with the name calling and such. Please just stop.
Behind the scenes I can assure you that nothing is as confrontational as you imply.
btw, Digium was offering training a few years before Fonality or probably anyone else for that matter.
"Reason" usually comes with
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 2:10pm
"Reason" usually comes with facts. And as always, you present fantasies of your own mind insinuating statements that were never made and claims that are certifiably false. I won't bother to respond any longer as there is no need to give you reason to waste the communities time any more then you have already done so.
As promised the complete
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 2:27pm
As promised the complete release of all source code on the Company Directory. Please see the following post.
http://www.freepbx.org/news/2008-02-06/asterisk-voice-recognition...
fbosco,
I have to say that
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 2:29pm
fbosco,
I have to say that freepbx is the engine that makes the trix car go. REALLY FAST!
Since the freePBX product is so tightly integrated in trixbox, I don't have a problem with Philippe's posts with the occasional reference to his product's events or offerings.
For one thing if freePBX doesn't make some kind of revenue...the program STOPS.
Then what do you do? Expect him to live at the salvation army while advancing the project?
(Thats a hint from me...why not make a sizable donation)
I have to agree with cosmicwombat. Let it go.
How do you know that
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 2:57pm
How do you know that Phillipe is relying on money to continue? Seems he doesn't have much of a job, I have heard he is either retired or cashed out of some company and doesn't need income to continue. I personally don't like wading through anyone's ads either from some lame overseas PBX company, some fly by night voip company, or from FreePBX. Its not fair to any other company that wants to post advertising here and aren't allowed.
When have I hid it?
fbosco
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 3:18pm
Robert,
Let me point out
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 4:41pm
Robert,
Let me point out that it is you who called me out for no reason. I am simply stating the obvious facts that have been brought up by numerous people here and people are calling BS on that (love your site Kerry!). The general non-willingness to pay is not something I extracted from my sphincter. This is based on many posts here from the likes of Kerry and Phillipe themselves about the almost total absence of donations. Then Tony has to get a word in by calling that FUD when it is a reality. The fact that Tony has an apparently successful business by providing complete solutions to customers is testament to his business savvy and has far less to do with the technology or the underlining code. I would bet that the vast majority of Tony's users have never heard of trixbox or Asterisk.
Every few months some lamer will go and post about their trinidad DID's, some new softswitch, some cheap phone, and the community flames the person for spamming the forums and yet, we see posts from i9, Rhino, Schmooze, Phillipe, Robert hawking the freepbx training which is FAR more obnoxious since it a) is not fair to anyone else that tries to advertise in the forums, b) is a cheap exploitation of the community that trixbox has built, and c) appears to be a desperate attempt to fill empty seats. Just because I disagree with you and think those blatant ads should be banned along with everyone else I get flamed back. That is hypocrisy at its finest. There should be no double standard here period. What does trixbox gain by letting FreePBX advertise? I would bet not a damned thing. If they want to advertise for their commercial paid training, let them buy banner ads or sponsor blocks on the site like everyone else does.
Fred - Defender of Reason
Just to clarify
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 5:08pm
Just to clarify, the "Voices" are for Cepstral the text-to-speech engine. Those are $29/voice. All you really need is "Asterisk Allison" 8k voice for telephony. Cepstral can be replaced by the open source Flite tts engine, though the quality isn't nearly as good.
LumenVox is where the speech recognition comes from. There are no open source solutions that are even remotely capable of replacing LumenVox, and there probably never will be.
What I am going to propose to LumenVox, however, is letting us setup a central license server accessible on the Internet and "pool" licenses together for overflow. In this scenario, each PBX could have 1 or 2 physical licenses and then get additional overflow licenses over the Internet in real-time. I have already tested the LumenVox license server under this client-server model, and it works. When a PBX needs speech, it ask the license server for a license. If the license server has a license available, it doles it out. As soon as the PBX is done recognizing speech, it releases the license back to the license server.
Theoretically, this could provide the community with a reasonably inexpensive way to add speech to their PBXs. There is still going to be some cost involved, because relying on the Internet 100% is just fools talk, and regardless someone is going to have to buy the licenses for the licensing server, though with some sort of monthly/yearly hosting model, these expenses could be recouped quite quickly.
These are all things that will be discussed in the future with LumenVox.
Ethan
I don't know anything about
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 5:14pm
I don't know anything about the lumenvox product but I'd be willing to bet it could be done in open source. I never thought I would see decent open source or free swec but OSLEC seems to be doing pretty well.
A few years ago nobody thought there would ever be a decent open source PBX that could ever compete with the commercial stuff and well......
Sphinx
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 5:17pm
Mustardman,
I would love to see a viable alternative here, but unfortunately, there just isn't one, and I don't foresee there being one for many years to come (if ever).
You are referring to sphinx, and no offense to whoever may take offense, but it sucks in comparison to LumenVox. There is a reason speech recognition is so expensive, and that is because it is one of the most technically difficult things a computer can do, so it requires huge R&D dollars that need to be recouped eventually.
I am personally 100% OK with the expense for speech recognition, however. As an "add-on", speech recognition is something I can use in customer demos to get them excited, and if they *really* want it, they can buy it. It comes down to choice.
Ethan
Lumenvox is built on top of
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 5:28pm
Lumenvox is built on top of Sphinx. Do some reading about what Lumenvox had to do to get it to work right and you begin to see what Ethan is talking about. It is a huge effort that cost tons of money in development and research. The story of the Lumenvox product is quite interesting.
dstroot, here is a saying for you...it is often better to be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt.
It is a line between hobbiest and business use
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 5:48pm
It is a line between hobby and business use. Once you start buying a few phones or a TDM card then $50 doesn't seem so bad. I bought the Allison 8K, more or less, in preparation for the Button. For the moment, it is for curiosities sake as this has especially high geek appeal.
btw, the Allison 8k voice was worth it.
Robert,
You are right
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 6:00pm
Robert,
You are right that the cost "doesnt seem so bad" but because it is a feature that is intended for everyone in the office to use to make calls, manage calls, etc, it is likely to have heavy use. Each use requires a channel license. Today, you can get a starter kit which is 1 channel for $50, then each additional channel is $250, since you have to plan for maximum peak usage you probably need a 1:3 ratio of channels to users. If you have 6 employees you need a minimum of 2 licenses ($300). At 6 users you are at $1,250, possibly more if the feature gets heavy usage. I would beg to argue that for $250 a user you would be better off getting trixbox Pro Call Center Edition with HUD Pro. Considering that the primary argument against trixbox Pro is the cost, I can't see how most people would fork out $250/user for a magic button when they don't want to spend that much on all of the features of Pro plus HUD.
While Ethan's shared license plan is rather interesting, the delay of checking a license server across the internet may introduce too much lag time for users.
I agree
Wed, 02/06/2008 - 6:11pm
I for one will gladly pay
Thu, 02/07/2008 - 10:27am
I for one will gladly pay the $50 + $29 + whatever to have that tool - it is a "hype" tool to get my prospective clients hyped up about what the system can do, I get the feeling that probably 1/15 final sales would actually want this thing, but none the less, it probably helped to sell trixbox on the other 14 sales. I have been working with Lumenvox for a long time (not using it much, but some in the past) - I never sold their product, but they did help me on other telephony platforms as a "feature" to make a sale. Before them about the only thing for speech rec was Nuance, and it was $XK to even call them, Lumenvox has done what opensource has done - they have brought speech rec down to an achievable level for the common person [or business] and they have done it well. While its not free like open source, and I doubt it will in the next 10-15 years, its not expensive.
For the trixbox user at large this probably wont be of much interest (as far as real use), but for a considerable percentage of us I believe it definitely is - anyone that sells this as a PBX platform can afford to pay at least $200 to have this "geek toy" - even if they never resell it, it is true tool that speaks for itself.
I also love to see Philippe here in the forums, he already has plenty of work doing dev, maintaining his own forum, and yet he still comes here to help people and on an almost daily basis, if not just yesterday. So I welcome him anytime to let me know in anyway how I can assist freepbx, I dont have time to go to the training, but I was able to make a small donation. I wish I could give more, and do every chance I get. His training has sparked a lot of fruitful content, and the training hasnt even started yet - I would say thats an awesome contribution to the community.
As for Ethan - I hope he holds his magic button for ransom to Micro$oft - I am sure they would pay dearly to not see that released ;)
And yes - I use these products and am a huge "FANBOY".
Cheers-
-John Hyde
Just a thought - I made a
Thu, 02/07/2008 - 11:54am
Just a thought - I made a wiki section for collaboration on this project:
http://www.trixbox.org/wiki/voice-rec
People can post code, and guides there.
This will become a must have with Blackberries out there
Thu, 02/28/2008 - 11:29pm
Let me first briefly explain what I do. I am an engineer working for a company of 40 employees. As a hobby I have been using asterisk since the A@Home days.
Recently, I did an install for a small business in Toronto - I did this as a side business from my primary job as an Elec. Engineer. And now I have convinced my employer to replace the 15 year old Meridian system with Asterisk based IP PBX. I got them to approve a budget for it. And last week, after getting some feedback on what features the employees would like to see in the new system, some interesting point came up about the dial by directory to any IVR with Blackberries - Their buttons have different letter assignments and it is a frustrating experience trying to spell someone's name. So one thing our company like to see is to have a voice recognition feature. And we are considering Lumenvox. We are Engineering and Design company so 10 POTS lines we have has been adequate for nearly 40 extensions. I assume 5 license should be good enough for us.
But the point I want to make here is that because of this Blackberry issue it was not difficult to convince them to have voice recognition and spend the money.
Also, I want to tell the community that I will make a reasonable donation for the small side install I did (Still have not got the check from them) as well as I will try to convince my employer to make a donation to the community since if they can afford to spend $120 per phone, $2K for server, $1K for Sangoma POTS cards and ~1K for Lumenvox and $2K for me to go and hire someone to do the install (They dont want me to spend time on this as my primary job in the company is elec. engineering), I think it would not be fair to not donate.
But I have a little dilemma here, who do I donate? For my side small install, I used trixbox but it comes with freepbx and behind all of these is Linux and Asterisk. For the company install, the person we have hired will use Elastix which also uses freepbx, linux, asterisk, etc.
Is there a foundation that I can contribute and select the different open srouce projects that I can select and distribute the donation to? Or do I breakup and go to different sites make the donations?
I saw, asterisk and AMP(Freepbx) part of the FSF.org but did not see Trixbox and Elastix in there. Is that a good place to donate or do they pass on a portion of the donation?
If you are looking for the
Fri, 02/29/2008 - 7:32am
If you are looking for the Voice Recognition applications and in particular you like the idea of the company directory, all the work is going on over at FreePBX. You can see the company directory information there:
http://freepbx.org/news/2008-02-06/asterisk-voice-recognition-com...
As far as where you should donate and the answer to your question, there is not place that is distributing donations amongst the main projects that are delivering to you what you mention in this thread (Asterisk, FreePBX, Elastix, trixbox) so you'll have to decide who is giving you the key features that you are looking for in making your decision. If it is the core PBX and Voice Recognition work going on - then FreePBX. If it is the integration and packaging of Linux, Asterisk, FreePBX, etc - then trixbox. If it is Asterisk, then I've got Digium's community director sitting right next to me as we speak, and he says 'just give it to the FreePBX team - they're doing a great job.)
Member Since:
2007-01-16